Is Christianity just an abusive relationship?

It occured to me that the Christian God is just an abusive boyfriend and Christians make all the typical excuses for his horrendous behaviour:

"That was the old testament, he's changed!",

"It's because he loves us",

"It's our fault, we're bad!",

"I know he can be really rough sometimes but there are also times when he can be really sweet!"

"I can't leave him, what will people say!"

And the ultimate: "Don't even think about saying this kind of stuff, you have no idea what he'd do to us if we tried to leave him!"

I see religion as an extreme version of OCD & intrusive thoughts.

Don't do this or you will suffer eternally, do this and you'll be rewarded by something you don't know exists. Do this certain pattern of praying etc or something bad will happen.

And much like OCD, it isn't healthy and should be treated.

And the constant negging, which is even worse.

Listen to a little girl singing 'Amazing Grace' sometime, and realize the message she's internalized.

I'm shit, I'm worthless, I'm fundamentally morally bankrupt, I'm human garbage fit only for salvage, I deserve nothing. And that someone should lower themselves to be decent to me despite all of this is wonderful of them beyond all comprehension.

It's pure rent-seeking codependency. Cut off their self-esteem above the knee, then rent them crutches with your brand plastered all over it, as a huge favour to them, for which they must be duly grateful.

If you think about it, it's even worse than that. Since God's made up, It’s self abuse.

An unproven concept that believers return to habitually as a short-cut to cope with the world around them. No matter how illogical the concept is they force themselves to subscribe to it in order to "feel" okay about the world. It requires no investigative fact finding or objective thinking. They choose only to subvert their personal responsibility to investigate and find facts. It's really about being addicted to a bunch of chemical reactions in the brain built around allegorical, fictitious nonsense. Minds huddling around a pleasure center pump built on illusions of patterns that don't exist.

'Man was created in the image of God' - It’s almost like man created God in his image.

And God was created in the image of an abuser to help justify and vindicate their actions.

Emotional manipulation and coercion is abusive, regardless if it comes from an individual or belief system. Monotheism (the belief that there is only one God) is the desire to be an eternal slave to a sadistic cosmic dictator who has given every indication that he either doesn't care for your suffering or is in-fact rather delighted by it.

I have Christian friends and family members that all either have superiority or inferiority complexes... it's some freakish abusive power dynamic that holds you hostage. It saddens me to no end. I just wish they could see this and I could explain it to them. It restricts their lives

It's a very unhealthy, one-sided, abusive relationship.

"I have a place full of torment and fire and torture and you'll spend eternity there if you don't believe in me... but I love you so much that I sacrificed myself to myself to serve as a loophole for rules that I created and am in control of."

Christian beliefs, along with other faith-based beliefs, are intrinsically problematic because they hinder a person's ability to think critically and skeptically. A diminished capacity for critical thinking (compartmentalization notwithstanding) is a huge problem because it affects decision-making in many facets of human life. Beliefs inform actions. Beliefs matter. As a species we'd be better off if we cared about whether or not the things we believed were true and if we applied rigorous standards of evidence to making those determinations.

I would add that a moral system based on a myth leaves the believer open to manipulation. The myth itself can always be interpreted in a range of ways, and each way can be touted as the will of god, or the correct moral choice, when in fact it is simply a way for someone to get what they want. Because of this, I see religious belief as inherently dangerous, because even if it is used wisely, fairly and safely now, there is no way to ensure that someone won't walk in next week and convince everyone to bash someone to death for being raped.

Religion is like leaving a loaded gun in the house.

Restofit, is there something in your life that makes you feel this way?

I ask because while I agree with all the points you make below, and I would even go one further and agree with Nietzsche's assessment that religion constitutes slave morality,  I can't help but notice that for you it seems to be about more than the rejection of religion in your personal life. It seems personal. Is someone forcing religion on you? You keep starting these posts - and there is nothing wrong with them - but are you looking for something more than banter? Is there something religion is forcing on you?

I ask because if that's the case, I am in the same boat. Some of my family are members of a cult, and they practice strict shunning that has ripped my family apart. Are you going through something similar? Is there something we can talk through?

Haha, and you told me he wasn’t trolling Codeguy? You can see it from a mile away. He starts an anti-religion thread every 2 weeks and the first 3 posts are his trying to get others in on it. Wash/Rinse/Repeat. Classic trolling. Fuck off restofit.

Restofit, is there something in your life that makes you feel this way?

I ask because while I agree with all the points you make below, and I would even go one further and agree with Nietzsche's assessment that religion constitutes slave morality,  I can't help but notice that for you it seems to be about more than the rejection of religion in your personal life. It seems personal. Is someone forcing religion on you? You keep starting these posts - and there is nothing wrong with them - but are you looking for something more than banter? Is there something religion is forcing on you?

I ask because if that's the case, I am in the same boat. Some of my family are members of a cult, and they practice strict shunning that has ripped my family apart. Are you going through something similar? Is there something we can talk through?

My family are devout Christian, I witness the insidious effect this mindset has on restricting the ability for rational thinking and empathy for others.

wishful thinking and denial of reality brings out the worst in people who you know have good intentions, but due to fear, and blind faith, these on the outset 'good' people resort to an attitude of divisiveness, hostility and hate.

The mindset is very much 'us vs them', like i said these 'good' well-intentioned people develop an unbearable superiority complex, because in their eyes - everyone else is being deceived.

As you would guess this has only amplified with the Covid situation. It's so unbelievably disheartening seeing my family, extended family and their friends fall down the rabbit hole of harmful and dangerous conspiracy theories.

And the reason these people are so susceptible to fringe-thinking is because they open themselves up to magical thinking simply by believing in god - in doing so they deflect all responsibly away from individuals and trust simply in 'god's will'..

My parents and siblings literally believe the rapture is coming soon, and Jesus will whisk them away into heaven. Everyone else is on the 'other-side' and are deserving of eternal damnation.

Faith gives (on the outset) good people this powerful superiority complex and incredible deflection of personal and societal responsibility.

It is incredibly disheartening myself to witness the ever-increasing societal degradation of these faith-based beliefs in my day to day life, I can't even relate to my own family and people around me anymore..

How did we as a species came to this??? it makes me filthy with rage for hours on end... I wish all faith-based beliefs could be wiped from the face of this earth.

The human-race had so much potential to create a loving, empathetic society where everyone could live in harmony with each other - including with the natural world.

But alas, any chance of any stable, happy future for the next generations has been single-handedly destroyed by our selfish insular tendencies, faith over reason/evidence.. and because of this we are most certainly doomed.

Perhaps if society had grown to accept objective truth/reason/science 30 years ago and society had managed to transition past irrational, reward-based, hopium-filled, selfish, insular personal beliefs we might've had a chance to stabilize climate change and prevent the ensuing subsequent degradation of the planet's entire inter-linked chain of ecosystems unraveling at this very moment..

Quote from: Codeguy on August 17, 2020, 11:54:00 AM

Restofit, is there something in your life that makes you feel this way?

I ask because while I agree with all the points you make below, and I would even go one further and agree with Nietzsche's assessment that religion constitutes slave morality,  I can't help but notice that for you it seems to be about more than the rejection of religion in your personal life. It seems personal. Is someone forcing religion on you? You keep starting these posts - and there is nothing wrong with them - but are you looking for something more than banter? Is there something religion is forcing on you?

I ask because if that's the case, I am in the same boat. Some of my family are members of a cult, and they practice strict shunning that has ripped my family apart. Are you going through something similar? Is there something we can talk through?

My family are devout Christian, I witness the insidious effect this mindset has on restricting the ability for rational thinking and empathy for others.

wishful thinking and denial of reality brings out the worst in people who you know have good intentions but due to fear these on the outset 'good' people resort to devidedness and hate tactics.

The mindset is very much 'us vs them', like i said these 'good' well-intentioned people develop an unbearable superioty complex, because in their eyes - everyone else is being decieved..

As you would guess this has only amplified with the Covid situation. It's so unbelievably disheartening seeing my family, extended family and their friends fall down the rabbit hole of harmful and dangerous conspiracy theories.

And the reason these people are so suscebtable to fringe-thinking is because they open themselves up to magical thinking simply by believing in god - in doing so they deflect all responsibly away from individuals and trust in 'god's will'

My parents and siblings literally believe the rapture is coming soon, and Jesus will whisk them away into heaven. Everyone else is on the 'other-side' and are deserving of eternal damnation.

Faith gives (on the outset) good people this powerful superiority complex and incredible deflection of personal and societal responsibility.

It is incredibly disheartening myself to witness the ever-increasing societal degradation of these faith-based beliefs in my day to day life, I can't even relate to my own family and people around me anymore..

How did we as a species came to this??? it makes me filthy with rage for hours on end... I wish all faith-based beliefs could be wiped from the face of this earth.

The human-race had so much potential to create a loving, empathetic society where everyone could live in harmony with each other - including with the natural world.

But alas, any chance of any stable, happy future for the next generations has been single-handedly destroyed by our selfish insular tendencies, faith over reason/evidence.. and because of this we are doomed.

Perhaps if society had grown to accept objective truth/reason/science 30 years ago and society had managed to transition past irrational, reward-based, hopium-filled, selfish, insular personal beliefs we might've had a chance to stabilise climate change and prevent the ensuing subsequent degradation of the planet's entire inter-linked chain of ecosystems unravelling at this very moment!

I figured something like this was going on ..... you and I have had similar paths resto..... I have no relationship with my cult mother and sister ...... it’s very frustrating to hear people close to you spout nonsense and drive themselves crazy hoping for a different life after the only life they can be sure they have is already gone ..... I can empathize .....


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Quote from: restofit on August 17, 2020, 11:55:18 PM

Quote from: Codeguy on August 17, 2020, 11:54:00 AM

Restofit, is there something in your life that makes you feel this way?

I ask because while I agree with all the points you make below, and I would even go one further and agree with Nietzsche's assessment that religion constitutes slave morality,  I can't help but notice that for you it seems to be about more than the rejection of religion in your personal life. It seems personal. Is someone forcing religion on you? You keep starting these posts - and there is nothing wrong with them - but are you looking for something more than banter? Is there something religion is forcing on you?

I ask because if that's the case, I am in the same boat. Some of my family are members of a cult, and they practice strict shunning that has ripped my family apart. Are you going through something similar? Is there something we can talk through?

My family are devout Christian, I witness the insidious effect this mindset has on restricting the ability for rational thinking and empathy for others.

wishful thinking and denial of reality brings out the worst in people who you know have good intentions but due to fear these on the outset 'good' people resort to devidedness and hate tactics.

The mindset is very much 'us vs them', like i said these 'good' well-intentioned people develop an unbearable superioty complex, because in their eyes - everyone else is being decieved..

As you would guess this has only amplified with the Covid situation. It's so unbelievably disheartening seeing my family, extended family and their friends fall down the rabbit hole of harmful and dangerous conspiracy theories.

And the reason these people are so suscebtable to fringe-thinking is because they open themselves up to magical thinking simply by believing in god - in doing so they deflect all responsibly away from individuals and trust in 'god's will'

My parents and siblings literally believe the rapture is coming soon, and Jesus will whisk them away into heaven. Everyone else is on the 'other-side' and are deserving of eternal damnation.

Faith gives (on the outset) good people this powerful superiority complex and incredible deflection of personal and societal responsibility.

It is incredibly disheartening myself to witness the ever-increasing societal degradation of these faith-based beliefs in my day to day life, I can't even relate to my own family and people around me anymore..

How did we as a species came to this??? it makes me filthy with rage for hours on end... I wish all faith-based beliefs could be wiped from the face of this earth.

The human-race had so much potential to create a loving, empathetic society where everyone could live in harmony with each other - including with the natural world.

But alas, any chance of any stable, happy future for the next generations has been single-handedly destroyed by our selfish insular tendencies, faith over reason/evidence.. and because of this we are doomed.

Perhaps if society had grown to accept objective truth/reason/science 30 years ago and society had managed to transition past irrational, reward-based, hopium-filled, selfish, insular personal beliefs we might've had a chance to stabilise climate change and prevent the ensuing subsequent degradation of the planet's entire inter-linked chain of ecosystems unravelling at this very moment!

I figured something like this was going on ..... you and I have had similar paths resto..... I have no relationship with my cult mother and sister ...... it’s very frustrating to hear people close to you spout nonsense and drive themselves crazy hoping for a different life after the only life they can be sure they have is already gone ..... I can empathize .....


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Heartbreaking read, guys.

There are many ways to break up a family. In the end it seems like most people like to develop a « comfort zone » (religion, politics, denial, addiction...) from which they don’t wish to wake up.

Codeguy, if you don't mind me asking, what kind of cult are we talking about?

Codeguy, if you don't mind me asking, what kind of cult are we talking about?

Jehovahs witnesses